The genealogists the think it over significant one to Nicholas’ wife Clementia try incorporated right here given that, under normal circumstances, she’d never be mentioned. Whenever Susanna on some later date obtained out over another protector, the spouse of this protector wasn’t mentioned.
This would mean that Queen John invested a little while here and you will the potential for an enthusiastic amorous liaison having Clementia can be acquired
What follows listed here is a theory state-of-the-art from the particular eminent genealogists, however it is reasonable to declare that the fresh new results try hotly competitive!
That it idea causes a delightful and you may curious ‘twist’ on the facts from Joanna, which could appeal admirers off HBD!
At first glance, there would be nothing to recommend one partnership between your hostage, Susanna of Wales and you may Clementia, wife out of Nicholas de- Verdun. Although not, sensation of particular genealogists having international hostages, for example youths, might have been which they was basically commonly put which have loved ones, or no was in fact readily available.
Moving toward 1236, you will find an admission throughout the Tewkesbury annals which pertains to Joanna’s mother as “Queen Clemencie!” They reads simply:
Today, it is known that the mommy from Joanna are entitled Clementia (Clemence?
In such a case the monk are obviously indulging in medieval legalism. Before her death, Joanna is legitimised by Pope. On such basis as one to legitimisation, this new Tewksbury monk plainly grabbed they upon himself to raise Joanna’s mommy towards reputation out-of Queen, because if her mom had been Queen John’s wife! It is true but not, you to definitely Queen John and Clementia had been never partnered. Because of the talking about Joanna’s mommy while the “Queen” Clementia, the monk which filed Joanna’s demise are exhibiting his tall admiration having Joanna, but not attempting to change the real circumstances.
As for the label regarding Clementia de- Verdun, Paget implies that she is the brand new child off Roger de- Dauntsey, of Wiltshire. One genealogist considers they high you to Clementia acclaimed from Wiltshire while the he has got noticed that Queen John got a robust attachment to one to county, it as being the domestic out of their safest allies, the newest Longespee, ilies and you may Geoffrey Fitz Peter.
Genealogists found that name ‘Clementia’ are very uncommon certainly one of English noblewomen associated with the months. In one table off ladies brands that was built-up, there have been simply several events of your own name “Clementia” regarding all in all, 1407 ladies in the newest sample! The fact people named Clementia could be associated with Susanna represents tall.
Very! Evidence is suggestive, but not definitive, you to in 1228, Susanna, just like the an effective hostage, got out to new proper care of their own maternal grandma, now partner out of Nicholas de- Verdun!!
New Scottish genealogists of your own MacDuffs’ hold you to definitely Susanna ferch Llywelyn was created 1214 from inside the Gwynnedd, Wales and you can died c. 1259 when you look at the Dunfermline, Fife, Scotland. She married Malcolm MacDuff, Earl out-of Fife for the 1230 along with several children: Sir Colbran MacDuff, Earl regarding Fife, produced 1245, died 1270 and you may MacDuff MacDuff created 1247.
Definitely, there are avoid objections to any or all it conjecture! King John got of numerous mistresses and possibly as many as 7 illegitimate pupils. The caretaker out-of Joanna would-have-been produced circa 1172 and marriageable circa 1184. Joanna herself came to be circa 1191 (14 yrs old during their unique relationships to Llywelyn). Rohese, the understood genuine daughter out-of Nicholas de Verdun with his partner Clementia came to be circa 1210-1213 https://brightwomen.net/fi/kiinalaiset-naiset/. When the Clementia are the mother out-of Joanna, she would are in their later 30’s, very early 40’s whenever giving birth to Rohese! Not impossible, some say, however, not likely.